[19:53] <VCI-Bob> How are you tonight, called?

[19:53] <called__out-VHL> 10I am doing great :) How are you?

[19:54] <VCI-Bob> doing good, thanks! :)

[19:54] <called__out-VHL> 10Thought I would come early...sometimes I have trouble getting on line :)

[19:54] <Bezalel-VHL> Hi Called!

[19:54] <VCI-Bob> just installed a new PC - took me a whole day to get all of the stuff copied over!

[19:54] <called__out-VHL> 10I don't have a very powerful computer:)

[19:55] <VCI-Bob> my daughter is going to take the old one to college

[19:55] <called__out-VHL> 10Hi Ya Bez, how are you this eve?

[19:55] <VCI-Bob> well, I have a screamer now - very fast :)

[19:55] <called__out-VHL> 10New PC, sounds great...!

[19:55] <Bezalel-VHL> I'm good, Called. I was just whining to Bob about having to actually work today.

[19:56] <called__out-VHL> 10Maybe you need a vacation Bez !!!

[19:56] <VCI-Bob> yeah, works good except it had a bad video card in it when I got it

[19:56] <called__out-VHL> 10:-(

[19:56] <Bezalel-VHL> Bad video...bummer Bob. It makes it hard to see the problem when nothing comes up.

[19:56] <VCI-Bob> but fortunately I had another one available :)

[19:56] <VCI-Bob> yeah :)

[19:56] <called__out-VHL> 10Read your post on War on the Horizon today. Great Bob

[19:57] <VCI-Bob> thanks, called :)

[19:57] <VCI-Bob> and the horizon keeps getting closer

[19:58] <VCI-Bob> Tonight, we are going to examine Isaiah chapters 24-26 in detail

[19:58] <called__out-VHL> 10I know I should be afraid, but I an practically on shouting ground.

[19:58] <VCI-Bob> yes, I know what you mean!

[19:58] <called__out-VHL> 10We have been studying this at church on Weds and it is amazing! What a day we live in.

[19:58] <VCI-Bob> that's the right response anyway - one day closer to the triumphant appearance of our Lord and Savior!

[19:58] <VCI-Bob> yes!

[19:59] <VCI-Bob> too many have the "afraid" response when talking about end-times stuff - but we must be strong and very courageous

[19:59] <Bezalel-VHL> But your dead will live; their bodies will rise. You who dwell in the dust, wake up and shout for joy. Your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead. Isa 26:19

[19:59] <VCI-Bob> for the Lord is with us :)

[20:00] <called__out-VHL> 10Beautiful Bez , Beautiful!

[20:00] <VCI-Bob> Good one, Bez! One of the more striking descriptions of the resurrection in the Old Testament

[20:00] <called__out-VHL> 10I have loved ones who I can't wait to see! At that great morning.

[20:00] <VCI-Bob> :)

[20:00] <Bezalel-VHL> I was reading the chapters before logging in for chat. Had to read pieces to my wife cause I got so excited.

[20:01] <VCI-Bob> yes, great stuff, huh!!!

[20:01] <called__out-VHL> 10Hang on tight Bez!

[20:01] <VCI-Bob> It's 8 PM, but not many here yet... hmmmm

[20:01] <Bezalel-VHL> You seem to point to some of the best, Bob.

[20:01] <VCI-Bob> did you guys have trouble getting in?

[20:01] <Bezalel-VHL> None, whatsoever.

[20:02] <VCI-Bob> there's so much that is the "best", right? :) We won't run out of material :)

[20:02] <called__out-VHL> 10:)

[20:02] <Bezalel-VHL> :-)Glory to God!

[20:02] <VCI-Bob> Hallelujah!

[20:02] <VCI-Bob> Lord, we ask your presence to be with us tonight

[20:03] <VCI-Bob> we praise your great Name, and stand in awe of your greatness

[20:03] <VCI-Bob> Guide our discussions, teach us, inspire us to know you better

[20:03] <VCI-Bob> and prepare us for the role that we will play in the days ahead

[20:03] <VCI-Bob> as your servants

[20:04] <VCI-Bob> Thank you, Jesus, for the atoning sacrifice you made for us

[20:05] <called__out-VHL> 10Thank you for your love for us and our love for each other...We know Lord that all good things come from you. Thank you for savings us and allowing us to be your sons and daughters. Open our eyes that we may learn of you in a mighty way.

[20:05] <VCI-Bob> Yes :)

[20:05] <VCI-Bob> Amen

[20:05] <Bezalel-VHL> Amen

[20:05] <VCI-Bob> ok, we might as well start, we'll let the stragglers catch up

[20:05] <called__out-VHL> 10Amen

[20:06] <called__out-VHL> 10:)

[20:06] <VCI-Bob> Since you read the passages, Bez, you can help me out :)

[20:06] <VCI-Bob> We'll go through it verse by verse for a little while

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[20:07] <VCI-Bob> See, the LORD is going to lay waste the earth and devastate it; he will ruin its face and scatter its inhabitants-- (Isaiah 24:1 NIV)

[20:07] <VCI-Bob> it will be the same for priest as for people, for master as for servant, for mistress as for maid, for seller as for buyer, for borrower as for lender, for debtor as for creditor. (Isaiah 24:2 NIV)

[20:07] <VCI-Bob> The earth will be completely laid waste and totally plundered. The LORD has spoken this word. (Isaiah 24:3 NIV)

[20:07] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Dove!

[20:07] <Bezalel-VHL> That second me, is just checking to see if there was a login problem.

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[20:08] <called__out-VHL> 10Hi Dove :)

[20:08] <Bezalel-VHL> Hi Dovecry:-)

[20:08] <VCI-Bob> Isaiah 24 speaks of the same events that John describes in Revelation

[20:08] <dovecry-VHL> Hello. How 's my friends doing?

[20:08] <VCI-Bob> but Isaiah has more of a "street level" view

[20:08] <VCI-Bob> doing good, Dove :)

[20:08] <called__out-VHL> 10Great Dove, good to see you :)

[20:09] <dovecry-VHL> You know what?

[20:09] <VCI-Bob> what?

[20:09] <Bezalel-VHL> I'm good here, too, Dove.

[20:09] <called__out-VHL> 10what

[20:09] <dovecry-VHL> I learned something you might find interesting , but I'm sure you already knew it.

[20:10] <VCI-Bob> Tell us :)

[20:10] <Bezalel-VHL> I probably don't know it....:-)

[20:10] <called__out-VHL> 10yes :)

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[20:10] <dovecry-VHL> Last night at church ths Pastor was telling us about Abraham, Issac and Ishmal

[20:11] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Farrell and Tim!

[20:11] <dovecry-VHL> well the light bulb went on in my head

[20:11] <farrell-VHL> 2Shaolm brothers and sisters :)

[20:11] <called__out-VHL> 10Yes, Dove :)

[20:11] <Tim-VHL> ;-)Good Evening Bob

[20:11] <VCI-Bob> Shalom!

[20:11] <dovecry-VHL> about the wars over there . they are fighting over the covenant

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[20:11] <called__out-VHL> 10Shaloom Tim and Farrell :)

[20:12] <VCI-Bob> Hello, Judy!

[20:12] <farrell-VHL> 2:) called out

[20:12] <Judy-VHL> Hi, how is everyone tonight?

[20:12] <called__out-VHL> 10:)

[20:12] <dovecry-VHL> of who has it or one thinks they have it, but we know who really has it:-) abraham

[20:12] <farrell-VHL> 2Shalom Judy:)

[20:13] <Judy-VHL> 5Hi'ya Farrell......I haven't been here in some weeks.

[20:13] <VCI-Bob> Yes, it was a unilateral covenant :) God enacted it

[20:13] <Tim-VHL> That was a pretty good chat with Stan the other night

[20:13] <dovecry-VHL> Forgive me but I'm on a roll here! Hello again everyone:-)

[20:13] <farrell-VHL> 2It is good that your pastor helps you study about the covenant Dovecry. Especially in these times :)

[20:14] <Judy-VHL> 5Hi Dove......glad to see you here!!!!

[20:14] <farrell-VHL> 2Yes it was, Tim. Very good.

[20:15] <VCI-Bob> As I mentioned, we will be looking at Isaiah 24-26 tonight

[20:15] <Tim-VHL> so what kind of trouble did Clinton get Israel in over there

[20:15] <VCI-Bob> and whatever else you with to discuss :)

[20:15] <dovecry-VHL> so tell me it's arafat who thinks his people have the rights to the to the land because of Ishmal being the first born . right?

[20:15] <Judy-VHL> 5I hate to admit this, but I am NOT up on what is going on with the talks. I assume they are failing (have failed?). What is the gist of the situation. Sorry if this is redundant to everyone.

[20:16] <VCI-Bob> Dove, they use all kinds of contrived "reasons" to claim prior rights to the land

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[20:16] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Judy, the talks failed - Arafat wanted all of East Jerusalem

[20:16] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Jerry :)

[20:16] <Judy-VHL> 5Hi Jerry

[20:17] <called__out-VHL> 10Jerry :)

[20:17] <Judy-VHL> 5Bob, was ANY of Jerusalem offered to the Palestinians by the Israelis?

[20:17] <VCI-Bob> And the leaders of Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Jordan told Arafat not to back down on Jerusalem

[20:17] <Jerry-VHL> Shalom All:-) Hey I just learned how to use the smileys

[20:17] <Tim-VHL> according to Muslim tradition, Muhammed went to Valhalla on the back of a white winged horse from the Temple Mount, or something like that

[20:17] <farrell-VHL> 2Hi Jerry :)

[20:17] <dovecry-VHL> Hi Judy.

[20:17] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Firstborn of a concubine versus firstborn of his wife.....

[20:17] <VCI-Bob> yes, unfortunately Judy, under some kind of unworkable "shared sovereignty" scheme

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[20:18] <Debi-VHL> Hi room, Hi Dove

[20:18] <Judy-VHL> 5I read somewhere that the European Union is telling Arafat NOT to back down also. True?

[20:18] <VCI-Bob> Right, Tim, that's their legend

[20:18] <dovecry-VHL> that's what I'm talking about Bob

[20:18] <dovecry-VHL> :-)

[20:18] <VCI-Bob> not explicitly, probably Judy, but certainly behind the scenes

[20:18] <farrell-VHL> 2Debi, Shalom :)

[20:18] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Debi!

[20:18] <dovecry-VHL> I have never understood it before now, not really WoW:-)

[20:18] <Judy-VHL> 5Hello, Debi.

[20:19] <VCI-Bob> cool, Dove :)

[20:19] <called__out-VHL> 10Hi Debi :)

[20:19] <Jerry-VHL> Hi :-)Debbie

[20:19] <Debi-VHL> Howdy Bob, what are we talking about?

[20:19] <VCI-Bob> about the failed peace summit right now

[20:19] <dovecry-VHL> Love! Delta

[20:19] <VCI-Bob> we will get into Isaiah shortly

[20:19] <Tim-VHL> Bob, correct me if I am wrong but isn't that great big rock in the middle of the mosque on the Temple mount emitting a stream of water

[20:20] <Jerry-VHL> That is also what I heard

[20:20] <VCI-Bob> Tim, there were reports of water coming from the base some months ago

[20:20] <dovecry-VHL> Ok, now Thank You Jesus! Hal-le-lu-jah

[20:20] <VCI-Bob> have not heard anything lately

[20:20] <Judy-VHL> 5Ok, what is the significance of the streaming water?

[20:20] <Jerry-VHL> They say that Stone is where Abraham went to sacrifice Isaac, True?

[20:21] <VCI-Bob> It's significant because of a prophecy in the book of Ezekiel

[20:21] <VCI-Bob> yes, that's right, Jerry

[20:21] <dovecry-VHL> reading

[20:22] <VCI-Bob> chapter 47

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[20:22] <dovecry-VHL> :-)

[20:22] <Jerry-VHL> Isn't that amazing how history is come full circle to where Abraham faithfulness began

[20:22] <Judy-VHL> 5Chapter 47 of Ezekiel?

[20:22] <Judy-VHL> 5Bob?

[20:22] <VCI-Bob> Ezekiel saw a vision of water flowing from the Temple area

[20:22] <VCI-Bob> yes, Judy

[20:22] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Babs

[20:22] <Judy-VHL> 5Ok

[20:22] <dovecry-VHL> Yes! awsome

[20:23] <Debi-VHL> Shalom Babs

[20:23] <VCI-Bob> The timing of that vision is apparently after the return of the Messiah Jesus

[20:23] <Tim-VHL> The Temple mount is also known as Mount Moriah, right?

[20:23] <Jerry-VHL> HiBabs

[20:23] <farrell-VHL> 2Re: Isa. 24 through 26, Bob, do you see this as the "Day of the Lord" referred to in other prophecies? Is this setting up Jesus' mil. kingdom?

[20:24] <called__out-VHL> 10Hi Ya Babs:)

[20:24] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Farrell - that's right - we'll look in more detail, but chapter 24 especially describes the day when God pours out His wrath on the earth

[20:24] <VCI-Bob> Right, Tim

[20:24] <babs-VHL> shalom what is going on since the summet meeting is over we really can not find out much

[20:25] <Bezalel-VHL> 2The day the Flat Earthers will finally be right, huh Bob?

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[20:25] <Tim-VHL> Zechariah 14 will give you a real good idea of what Armageddon will be like

[20:25] <VCI-Bob> babs, they are talking of reconvening the "peace talks" in a few days

[20:25] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Time

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[20:25] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Sarah and Sunshine!

[20:25] <VCI-Bob> Glad to have you join us!

[20:25] <Sarah-VHL> 6hi

[20:26] <farrell-VHL> 2I don't see any mention of the nation, Israel, in this chapter, so is God's wrath directed at the gentile nations rather than at Israel?

[20:26] <Debi-VHL> reconvening the peace talks, please explain more

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[20:26] <Jerry-VHL> Shalom Sharon and Sunshine and anyone else I may have missed

[20:26] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Farrell - just as in the book of Revelation...

[20:26] <Tim-VHL> Now I am all warmed up and I think I am in synchronization with you.

[20:26] <farrell-VHL> 2Cool :)

[20:26] <VCI-Bob> John saw the vision from heaven, but Isaiah gives us more of a "street level" view

[20:27] <VCI-Bob> Debi, I read that some of the negotiators (not the big guys) are going to start meeting again as soon as Sunday

[20:28] <VCI-Bob> Shall we discuss the "peace talks" a bit before going to Isaiah?

[20:28] <Debi-VHL> Bob, have you ever head of the Prophecy Study bible, it is great!

[20:28] <Sarah-VHL> 6I thought the talks were over. Is Jerusalem still at risk?

[20:28] <Jerry-VHL> Peace talks that's a laugh

[20:28] <VCI-Bob> yeah, Debi?

[20:28] <VCI-Bob> They are over, Sarah, but...

[20:29] <VCI-Bob> unfortunately Barak put an awful (that's the right word) lot on the table

[20:29] <Debi-VHL> It breaks down books of the bible in more detail, doing all with prophecy

[20:29] <farrell-VHL> 2Hey, vs. 3 of Zech. 14 says that Israel doesn't have to fight, THE LORD GOES OUT AND FIGHTS!

[20:29] <VCI-Bob> which will be the "starting point" for any future talks....

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[20:29] <VCI-Bob> unless Barak is ousted somehow

[20:29] <Sarah-VHL> 6even if Barak is ousted will it give power to the others?

[20:29] <called__out-VHL> 10it is such a powder keg, anything could happen

[20:29] <VCI-Bob> right, Farrell :) The Lord will fight :)

[20:29] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Jamere :)

[20:29] <Jerry-VHL> Shalom Jamere

[20:29] <VCI-Bob> Sounds good, Debi!

[20:30] <Bezalel-VHL> 2I saw he may have to make "peace" with Likud to keep his majority.

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[20:30] <farrell-VHL> 2Sorry, I am so slow in keeping up.

[20:30] <jamere-VHL> hello

[20:30] <VCI-Bob> He's on very shaky ground, Bez

[20:30] <mkiser-VHL> 13How do they think they can share the city?

[20:30] <VCI-Bob> Here's my assessment......

[20:30] <Bezalel-VHL> 2The same article stated that if he links with Likud, the Shas will bolt again....

[20:30] <VCI-Bob> Arafat and the Palestinians have drawn such a firm and unmoving line regarding East Jerusalem......

[20:31] <dovecry-VHL> Bob can you explain to me a little more about Ezekiel 47:1-12 ? I don't mean to interupt the schedual , but just briefly:-O

[20:31] <VCI-Bob> that only an act of insanity would let Israel give away that much and come to an "agreement"

[20:31] <VCI-Bob> sure, Dove, just a sec :)

[20:31] <dovecry-VHL> :-)thanks

[20:31] <VCI-Bob> if he links with Likud, he won't need Shas, I don't think

[20:32] <Sarah-VHL> 6Even if Barak offers, the people don't have to agree do they?

[20:32] <VCI-Bob> Mkiser, beats me - sounds very unworkable

[20:32] <Jerry-VHL> Bob, I don't want to break the thoughts here but I have a ? about a scripture as to whether we are talking in this timeframe or another? Isai.30:30-33. What do yo think???

[20:32] <mkiser-VHL> 13To me also, there is just no way for them both to have what they want.

[20:32] <VCI-Bob> Sarah, he has stated before that he would present any agreement to a popular referendum, but I don't think he is legally bound to do that

[20:33] <VCI-Bob> right, mkiser

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[20:33] <Tim-VHL> Bob, isn't it possible that a world leader who has disgraced himself and would do anything to look good in the history books would threaten to pull the security of Israel if they don't do what he says? This is speculative of course!!!

[20:33] <Sarah-VHL> 6No one is legally bound to Israel anymore:-( They just take and take away

[20:34] <VCI-Bob> Jerry, a quick answer - that v 27-33 in Isaiah 30 are indeed talking about the coming of the Lord in great power and glory

[20:34] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Aquaman

[20:34] <Jerry-VHL> What is your understanding of Tophet

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[20:34] <Jerry-VHL> Shalom Aquaman

[20:34] <VCI-Bob> Topheth is hell

[20:34] <aquaman-VHL> Hi Bob

[20:35] <farrell-VHL> 2Tim, do you think Israel would cave in to U.S. threats to pull security?

[20:35] <Jerry-VHL> Ah ha!!!

[20:35] <dovecry-VHL> But I thought Israel belonged to the choosen, the Jews, Back to the covenant. Frogive me if I'm lost again:-O

[20:35] <VCI-Bob> Topheth was a part of the valley of Ben Himmon, from which they got gehenna - the Greek word for "hell"

[20:35] <Tim-VHL> You bet that they would especially if the Arabs were promised to be militarily modernized if Israel didn't

[20:36] <VCI-Bob> Tim, I don't think Barak would be motivated like that, but Clinton might (your previous comment)

[20:36] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Dove, the land has been granted to the Jews, Abraham's descendants...

[20:36] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Amen, bob

[20:36] <Jerry-VHL> So basically God is preparing the pit for His enemies

[20:36] <VCI-Bob> but...

[20:37] <farrell-VHL> 2But, don't you think they will look to God and trust Him and not men?

[20:37] <dovecry-VHL> yes ok

[20:37] <VCI-Bob> they are not believing His promise, and the Arabs are tryign to take what is not theirs

[20:37] <VCI-Bob> right, Jerry

[20:37] <Jerry-VHL> Farrell the will at a certain time, and probably just in the nick of time

[20:37] <Tim-VHL> No prime minister in the history of Israel offered any part of Jerusalem, and Barak offers the eastern side. What could have been his motivator?

[20:37] <Debi-VHL> aren't we in the pretribulation raputure now?

[20:38] <VCI-Bob> Tim, I think that some of them really think that they have to make such decisions for "peace" - it's extremely naive

[20:38] <Jerry-VHL> I heard they didn't even let Benjamine have his time on the tv

[20:38] <VCI-Bob> what do you mean, Debi?

[20:38] <mkiser-VHL> 13Bob, do the Arabs, the decendants of Ishmael, believe they also have a promise.

[20:38] <Bezalel-VHL> 2I hope not Debi, that would mean I'm left behind.:-)

[20:38] <babs-VHL> one thing we know for sure none of this takes the lord by surprise

[20:38] <Sarah-VHL> 6I wonder if he was threatened into offering it, or brainwashed. ?

[20:38] <dovecry-VHL> ouch:-(

[20:38] <VCI-Bob> mkiser, I think they probably do have a promise of sorts - the Arabs have been given a huge amount of land

[20:38] <called__out-VHL> 10Left behind:-(:-O

[20:38] <farrell-VHL> 2I don't know, Tim. I just want to shake them and tell them LOOK TO THE LORD!

[20:38] <VCI-Bob> but they want it ALL

[20:39] <VCI-Bob> right, Babs :)

[20:39] <Jerry-VHL> Arabs that believe on Christ and understand the promist to Abraham are always welcome, God does not look at nationality

[20:39] <dovecry-VHL> Oh No:-O

[20:39] <VCI-Bob> God is working all of these events out according to His plans and purposes

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[20:39] <dovecry-VHL> Laughing :->

[20:39] <called__out-VHL> 10For His glory

[20:39] <VCI-Bob> Right, Jerry

[20:40] <Tim-VHL> Rabin offered land for peace and was gunned down by an Israeli zealot. Barak knows this. Don't you think he might be a little nervous right now for offering Jerusalem?

[20:40] <VCI-Bob> God selects people from all nations and tribes to be His people

[20:40] <dovecry-VHL> Yes, and I will rejoice in God my Savior !!!

[20:40] <VCI-Bob> those who put their faith in Jesus :)

[20:40] <farrell-VHL> 2Amen dove !

[20:40] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Tim, I would think so

[20:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6I don't think the people would allow any of Jerusalem to go to the Palestinians, do you, Bob???

[20:41] <VCI-Bob> not to mention that Barak has probably angered God for offering parts of Jerusalem

[20:41] <Perpetua-VHL> I have been out all day do we know for sure what Barak did and did not offer Arafat?

[20:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6God must be REALLY angry

[20:41] <VCI-Bob> Sarah, it seems, from the reports, that that is indeed what Barak was ready to do

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[20:42] <Sarah-VHL> 6Barak maybe, but would the citizens allow it? Would a coup develop I guess is what I am asking?

[20:42] <VCI-Bob> offering the Palestinians some degree of control over some neighborhoods in Jerusalem

[20:42] <Tim-VHL> What is sad is that Israel doesn't remember the prophecy of HaShem bringing together the dry bones. If they remembered this or had faith in this they would be raising cane over there.

[20:42] <VCI-Bob> not a coup, but perhaps a call for new elections may happen

[20:42] <dovecry-VHL> You know what I think is so awsome? How such a small plaec Jerusalem, can be such a cup of trembling...

[20:42] <Cephas-VHL> 4greetings

[20:42] <VCI-Bob> right Tim

[20:43] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Hi Cephas

[20:43] <farrell-VHL> 2Right, Tim! We can pray that Barak and others in authority will READ GOD'S WORD and His prophecies!!

[20:43] <called__out-VHL> 10Right Dove :) Will be true till Jesus comes back

[20:43] <Jerry-VHL> Amazing Isn't it. Just what prophecy say's but people don't want to see it.

[20:43] <VCI-Bob> yes, Dove - more evidence for the realiability of the Bible - - it's all working out the way HE said it would

[20:43] <VCI-Bob> Amen, Farrell :)

[20:43] <Judy-VHL> 5Peace will not come.........a war will break out. It is inevitable.

[20:43] <Jerry-VHL> ShalomCephas

[20:43] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Judy, I agree

[20:43] <dovecry-VHL> Right Farrell

[20:44] <Perpetua-VHL> Is anyone else concerned that the middle east will be at war right about the time of our presidential elections?

[20:44] <VCI-Bob> Wow, we have a lot of people in the room now!

[20:44] <Tim-VHL> I am going to probably look stupid here, but HaShem has issued a proclamation for all of His people to always pray for the peace of Jerusalem and the unity of Israel.

[20:44] <Sarah-VHL> 6That doesn't sound stupid

[20:44] <Jerry-VHL> Yes Tim!!!

[20:44] <called__out-VHL> 10Never thought of that Perpetua..hmm interesting

[20:44] <VCI-Bob> Perpetua.... Arafat has indicated he may postpone his declaration till November

[20:44] <Tim-VHL> I think that is in Isaiah but I can't remember where it is, that is why I sound stupid

[20:45] <dovecry-VHL> I'm (laughing) Bob:->

[20:45] <Jerry-VHL> Where are all the prayer warriors, they don't understand.

[20:45] <VCI-Bob> which seems to me because of US politics

[20:45] <VCI-Bob> the elections

[20:45] <farrell-VHL> 2Sounds wise to me Tim. Obey God and pray for the peace of Jerusalem :)

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[20:45] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bob, I wonder if this is going to be a "it depends on who is elected President" deal?

[20:45] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Rod

[20:45] <Jerry-VHL> Shalom Rod

[20:45] <Cephas-VHL> 4I'm kind of new to this , but are we to be praying for peace or for the harvest?

[20:45] <Rod-VHL> Hello all

[20:45] <dovecry-VHL> Yes, we Must pray for the Peace of Jerusalem

[20:46] <Sarah-VHL> 6Hi Rod

[20:46] <Jerry-VHL> Cephas - Keep praying and keep your eyes on Israel

[20:46] <VCI-Bob> Sarah, that does have some bearing on it, I would think

[20:46] <Perpetua-VHL> I think if Clinton has anything to do with it the war will begin early October. If that is the case he comes out smelling like a rose.

[20:46] <farrell-VHL> 2Psalm 122:6, Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

[20:46] <VCI-Bob> good question Cephas - as we examine what is happening...

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[20:47] <VCI-Bob> we play a dual role, right? praying that God will soon accomplish the things He has written, and praying that many Jewish people soon come to know their Messiah

[20:47] <Judy-VHL> 5Hey Kathy......howdy!

[20:47] <Jerry-VHL> Bob, how many people are allowed in this room?

[20:47] <dovecry-VHL> We should pray for both friend

[20:47] <Kathy-VHL> hi Bob and everybody

[20:47] <VCI-Bob> I think 50

[20:47] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Kathy

[20:47] <Debi-VHL> Amen Bob

[20:47] <babs-VHL> Idont think clinton can ever smell like anything good

[20:47] <Debi-VHL> Hi Kathy

[20:47] <farrell-VHL> 2Hi Kathy :)

[20:47] <Judy-VHL> 5LOL Babs!

[20:47] <VCI-Bob> Since there are so many people, please don't get upset if we miss a comment or question

[20:47] <Jerry-VHL> Were safe. But things are cooking glad I got a good night sleep

[20:47] <dovecry-VHL> for the laborers and for the Peace of Israel

[20:48] <VCI-Bob> just be persistent and repeat it and we will get to it :)

[20:48] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Only if you ask Hillary , Babs...:-O

[20:48] <Sarah-VHL> 6ouch

[20:48] <Tim-VHL> the election in the USA will decide where the USA will locate its capitol. The USA doesn't recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capitol because clinton is that kind of ????? Bush has already said that he would recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capitol

[20:48] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Tim, but we know how politicians tend to say one thing and do another

[20:48] <Jerry-VHL> I will vote for Bush based on that alone.

[20:48] <Perpetua-VHL> Well if we get involved in the war and it is success he takes the credit endorses Gore and gets the UN apointment. I fit is unsuccessful he will blame our involvement on the Republican congress.

[20:48] <VCI-Bob> hopefully Bush would follow through on that

[20:49] <Jerry-VHL> Republicans have always been pro Israel

[20:49] <Bezalel-VHL> 2But, Perpetua, which side would Clinton send support to?

[20:49] <VCI-Bob> Well, Jerry...

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[20:49] <Sarah-VHL> 6Clinton is getting a UN appointment?

[20:49] <VCI-Bob> the Jewish people in the US have the opinion that the Democrats are more pro-Israel in general

[20:50] <Tim-VHL> Clinton is the first US president that has not backed Israel. As a matter of fact, from an OPEC point of view, if Clinton goes in with Israel they will cut us off. You know Bill couldn't have that on his record

[20:50] <Perpetua-VHL> I was just throwing out a theory

[20:50] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Shira and Light :)

[20:50] <farrell-VHL> 2Why do the Jews think that, Bob?

[20:50] <Sarah-VHL> 6oh

[20:50] <VCI-Bob> Well, there may be some truth to that, farrell

[20:50] <Judy-VHL> 5Tim, I don't think Bush Sr. backed Israel either, really.

[20:50] <farrell-VHL> 2Shalom Light

[20:51] <VCI-Bob> there have been NO US Presidents that strongly supported Israel

[20:51] <light2-VHL> Hello to all and God Bless

[20:51] <Jerry-VHL> I think we all need to be politiaclly informed so I can vote right

[20:51] <VCI-Bob> none

[20:51] <Perpetua-VHL> I think that Clinton is interested in the Un appointment because of his views about the one world governement stuff.

[20:51] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Amen, Bob

[20:51] <Judy-VHL> 5HELLO LIGHT

[20:51] <VCI-Bob> only some worse than others

[20:51] <Jerry-VHL> shalom Light

[20:51] <light2-VHL> Hey Judy

[20:51] <Tim-VHL> Bob, I am a Christian Zionist in a Messianic Community, and the American press may be trying to sell Al Gore but that doesn't mean that the Jews are getting caught up in the propaganda

[20:51] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Although, Reagan had me spend 7 months off Beirut.....

[20:52] <dovecry-VHL> Is this politics night ? I guess I have spaggitti for brains:-O

[20:52] <farrell-VHL> 2I thought Reagan did support Israel?

[20:52] <Jerry-VHL> Reagan was known to have had a room specifially set aside to pray for Israel. The book Politics and prohecy or something to that effect said so.

[20:52] <VCI-Bob> :) Dove, we kinda get off track sometimes :)

[20:52] <Sarah-VHL> 6I was glad Bush Sr had missles to counter Iraq in Jerusalem during Desert Storm

[20:53] <farrell-VHL> 2I pray you are doing ok, dove. Will continue to remember you :)

[20:53] <called__out-VHL> 10me too Dove :)

[20:53] <dovecry-VHL> oh I'm sorry. I can be patient:-)

[20:53] <VCI-Bob> ok - let's talk Bible prophecy :)

[20:53] <Kathy-VHL> everything points to prophecy

[20:53] <Tim-VHL> Oh yes HE did. I was in a little situation that I am not at liberty to discuss, but we sure were Israel's ally under Big George

[20:53] <Rod-VHL> I don't think there will be peace in the middle east untill the antichrist steps onto the seen, i think this is what will make people follow him because he will have what seams to be a great contribution to the peace process.

[20:53] <Debi-VHL> I agree Bob, because I am lost with the politics

[20:54] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Rod, that's where it will eventually led, it seems

[20:54] <VCI-Bob> ok - let's spare our non-political friends in the room :)

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[20:54] <VCI-Bob> what question did you ask, Dove?

[20:54] <farrell-VHL> 2That is what Scripture says, isn't it Rod?

[20:54] <Rod-VHL> this man will appear to be the greatest peacemaker of all time

[20:54] <VCI-Bob> did someone ask about Ezekiel 47?

[20:54] <light2-VHL> Say I was watching Hal Lindsey just now and he said the EU is calling for a mark for people who want to sell

[20:55] <Judy-VHL> 5Are you sure Light?

[20:55] <Tim-VHL> Rod, you just nailed the prophecy. I asked a Rabbi under what conditions an Israeli PM would make a deal like that. His answer was simply:"if Israel was going to be wiped off the face of the earth, they would make a deal with the anti-christ

[20:55] <Sarah-VHL> 6No marks on this pretty face, thank you!

[20:55] <called__out-VHL> 10tell us more Light

[20:55] <light2-VHL> Yes Judy sure

[20:55] <VCI-Bob> LOL Sarah

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[20:55] <light2-VHL> Bob could you look at Jerimiah 25

[20:56] <Sarah-VHL> 6It's got JESUS on it, no other marks

[20:56] <VCI-Bob> sure, Light :) hold on, someone had a prior question

[20:56] <Jerry-VHL> brb

[20:56] <VCI-Bob> The man brought me back to the entrance of the temple, and I saw water coming out from under the threshold of the temple toward the east (for the temple faced east). The water was coming down from under the south side of the temple, south of the altar. (Ezekiel 47:1 NIV)

[20:56] <dovecry-VHL> :-)are you remembering my question Bob:-)

[20:57] <VCI-Bob> The Ezekiel walked further, and the water got deeper and deeper

[20:57] <dovecry-VHL> thank you :-)

[20:57] <VCI-Bob> this is after the Lord returns

[20:57] <Tim-VHL> A company in the USA has manufactured a micro-chip to be planted in your arm that will identify you. It is ready to go at this very moment.

[20:57] <VCI-Bob> after the several changes in the landscape described in Zechariah and other places

[20:57] <Debi-VHL> Bob we were discussing at work today about the new temple, will it be built spiirtually or physically?

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[20:58] <dovecry-VHL> good ? debi

[20:58] <VCI-Bob> the latter part of Ezekiel describes a physical temple that will be present when the Lord Jesus rules from Jerusalem

[20:58] <VCI-Bob> during the millenial Kingdom

[20:58] <light2-VHL> Are you sure it is not the one he brings with him Bob

[20:58] <Perpetua-VHL> When does the actual building take place?

[20:58] <Sarah-VHL> 6The water from the Mount happens AFTER Jesus returns?

[20:58] <Debi-VHL> Which chapter, so I can spread the work tomorrow

[20:58] <Judy-VHL> 5I vote for a physical building.........explain it being built spiritually>

[20:58] <babs-VHL> gotta go for now God Bless all of you

[20:58] <light2-VHL> He is bringing a temple to New Jerusalem

[20:59] <VCI-Bob> right Sarah

[20:59] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Bye Babs

[20:59] <Jerry-VHL> This water is for the healing for the nations

[20:59] <light2-VHL> nite babs

[20:59] <dovecry-VHL> are we still in 47

[20:59] <called__out-VHL> 10bye Babs:)

[20:59] <Rod-VHL> The pure red heffers are now being bread int the states by a christian farmer who has devoted is life to this task

[20:59] <Tim-VHL> American people are so out of touch with the Bible that they think that this chip is a good idea.

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[20:59] <VCI-Bob> Ezekiel 40 and the cpaters following describes the Temple in detail

[20:59] <Perpetua-VHL> Not all American people

[20:59] <called__out-VHL> 10I didn't know that Rod !!

[20:59] <VCI-Bob> and also the land allocations around it to the different tribes

[20:59] <Debi-VHL> Thank you

[21:00] <Tim-VHL> There are two confirmed red heifers in Israel right now. They have been confirmed by the very Rabbi that needs to confirm them

[21:00] <Rod-VHL> i can vouch for that i am canadain andlie right ontthe border with the states

[21:00] <called__out-VHL> 10wow!

[21:00] <Sarah-VHL> 6what does the red heifer mean?

[21:00] <Rod-VHL> my key board is sticking sorry

[21:00] <dovecry-VHL> what about the braisen altor?

[21:01] <Judy-VHL> 5How old are the heifers, Tim? And where did you get this information?

[21:01] <dovecry-VHL> I'm getting lost again:-(

[21:01] <VCI-Bob> yes, there are some in Texas, and also some in Israel - that's what I have heard

[21:01] <VCI-Bob> red heifers that is

[21:01] <Rod-VHL> the red heffer has to be the first sacrifice on the new temple alter

[21:01] <Debi-VHL> I'm totally lost

[21:02] <VCI-Bob> I know - the chat tends to jump around :)

[21:02] <Sarah-VHL> 6Me too Debi and Dovecry.

[21:02] <Tim-VHL> Now, the red heifer is necessary for the purification of the priestly garments and instruments so that a preist can purify the Temple Mount with more ashes. The ashes of the red heifer are for purification

[21:02] <called__out-VHL> 10Me too Debi and Dove:)

[21:02] <VCI-Bob> sorry, folks - it can get confusing at times

[21:02] <dovecry-VHL> God bless this mess:-)

[21:02] <VCI-Bob> yeah :)

[21:02] <Rod-VHL> someone with a better memory will know where this is in the bible

[21:02] <Bezalel-VHL> 2:->DOve

[21:02] <Judy-VHL> 5Rod, I thought that the red heifer must be sacrificed BEFORE the building of the Temple.....to consecrate the ground?

[21:02] <light2-VHL> Bob can you look at Jer, 25:11

[21:02] <dovecry-VHL> my prayers are sent your way BoB

[21:03] <VCI-Bob> thanks, Dove :) I appreciate that

[21:03] <Rod-VHL> yes youare right sorry

[21:03] <VCI-Bob> sure, light, hold on

[21:03] <Jerry-VHL> They don't understand Christ perfect sacrifice, so this sacrifice is cannot be of God.

[21:03] <light2-VHL> There it is definitely talking about the end time babylon and says they will be servinging 70 years

[21:03] <Tim-VHL> My information is coming from the Director of Temple Restoration. He was interviewed on TV about a month ago

[21:03] <farrell-VHL> 2Somewhere in Leviticus, Rod.

[21:03] <Rod-VHL> thankyou

[21:03] <light2-VHL> that must be the place where AJ Pink was saying the tribulation would last 70 years

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> well, yes and no, light.....

[21:04] <Debi-VHL> Bob, why don't you throw out a scripture or a topic and ask us to give our thougths on it

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> This whole country will become a desolate wasteland, and these nations will serve the king of Babylon seventy years. (Jeremiah 25:11 NIV)

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> "But when the seventy years are fulfilled, I will punish the king of Babylon and his nation, the land of the Babylonians, for their guilt," declares the LORD, "and will make it desolate forever. (Jeremiah 25:12 NIV)

[21:04] <light2-VHL> Ok what is yes and what is no?

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> This is what Daniel read in Daniel chapter 9....

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> when he was reading from Jeremiah..

[21:04] <Judy-VHL> 5Ok, Tim............I wonder how old the heifer is at present, because the heifer must be sacrificed when it is 3 years old.

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> and realized that the time in exile in Babylon was just about over

[21:04] <VCI-Bob> the 70 years

[21:05] <farrell-VHL> 2Bob, wasn't that 70 years completed and fulfilled?

[21:05] <VCI-Bob> however, you are right, light...

[21:05] <VCI-Bob> that parts of that chapter are indeed talking about the end-times

[21:05] <VCI-Bob> yes, it was, farrell...

[21:05] <Rod-VHL> is there a way to save this chat for further study??

[21:05] <VCI-Bob> however....

[21:05] <VCI-Bob> Rod, there will be a transcript on VHL tomorrow

[21:05] <Tim-VHL> Yes mam you are correct, and on top of that, Jewish tradition has it that It is suppose to happen either one or two weeks before Rosh Hashanah

[21:06] <Rod-VHL> great!

[21:06] <VCI-Bob> however, the 70 years may also have end time significance...

[21:06] <Judy-VHL> 5You talking to me Tim?

[21:06] <farrell-VHL> 2Explain :)

[21:06] <VCI-Bob> it is also mentioned in Zechariah chapter one, and to me that seems to be about the end

[21:06] <light2-VHL> I think it does, also

[21:06] <Tim-VHL> yes Judy

[21:06] <VCI-Bob> but I don't have it all figured out yet LOL

[21:06] <Sarah-VHL> 6 70 years for what?

[21:07] <light2-VHL> 70 years sounds like a long time, but not to God

[21:07] <Perpetua-VHL> Where does the heifer fit in the end times time line?

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[21:07] <Judy-VHL> 5Oh, ok......so when is Rosh Hashana? In the fall?

[21:07] <VCI-Bob> 70 years that Judah would be in Babylon - that's for sure, already fulfilled at the time of Daniel

[21:07] <light2-VHL> Sarah the 70 years might mean the length of the tribulation

[21:07] <Sarah-VHL> 6RoshHashannah starts Sept 30 this year

[21:07] <VCI-Bob> I don't think so, light -

[21:07] <VCI-Bob> where does it say that?

[21:07] <light2-VHL> Yes but chapter 25 is really mostly speaking of end times for all nations

[21:08] <VCI-Bob> yes, Judy

[21:08] <VCI-Bob> true, but remember...

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[21:08] <Judy-VHL> 5Thanks Sarah and Bob.

[21:08] <VCI-Bob> that when examining Bible prophecy...

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[21:08] <VCI-Bob> the prophet often spoke of near and far events in the same breath, with no distinction

[21:09] <VCI-Bob> which makes it tricky to interpret at times

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[21:09] <VCI-Bob> which is why we need the Holy Spirit to teach us :)

[21:09] <Sarah-VHL> 6amen

[21:09] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Amen, Bob

[21:09] <Tim-VHL> Christian tradition on the length of tribulation is 7 years

[21:09] <VCI-Bob> personally, I see the "tribulation" as 3 1/2 years

[21:10] <light2-VHL> Amen to that

[21:10] <called__out-VHL> 10I have heard others say that Bob

[21:10] <Debi-VHL> From this time forward?

[21:10] <Judy-VHL> 5Why Bob?

[21:10] <called__out-VHL> 10Why do you think so?

[21:10] <VCI-Bob> the 70th week is 7 years, but the first half may not be "the tribulation" - just a thought

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[21:10] <VCI-Bob> Debi, not yet

[21:10] <Tim-VHL> I agree with you Bob, and those 3 and1/2 years are the last half of the 7 years

[21:10] <light2-VHL> But that is what most modern scholars were teaching

[21:10] <VCI-Bob> yes, Tim

[21:11] <light2-VHL> This Pink gentleman is from the late 1890s

[21:11] <Jerry-VHL> I must go pick up my son now, So God bless all and I look forward to the script so make it good!

[21:11] <Debi-VHL> From what date does the 70 years begin, I don't understand

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[21:11] <VCI-Bob> but remember, we cannot be dogmatic on such things

[21:11] <Sarah-VHL> 6bye Jerry

[21:11] <Judy-VHL> 5My understanding is that the Tribulation is 7 years.......the last 3 1/2 years is the Great Tribulation.

[21:11] <Jerry-VHL> My smiley's dont work

[21:11] <Kathy-VHL> That is how I understand it too Judy

[21:11] <light2-VHL> Bye Jerry, don't you wish this was a video??

[21:11] <VCI-Bob> Debi, I don't know if there is even a 70 years that refers to the end - we're all trying to figure it out :)

[21:11] <called__out-VHL> 10So Bob, do you believe in a mid-trib rapture?

[21:12] <VCI-Bob> so I don't understand a lot either, Debi :)

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[21:12] <Judy-VHL> 5Alright Kathy.......Amen

[21:12] <Debi-VHL> LOL:-)

[21:12] <light2-VHL> Well read Jerimiah 25 again

[21:12] <VCI-Bob> Called, I tend to think it will be post trib or pre-wrath

[21:12] <Jerry-VHL> Yes, it is so nice to know there is a place like this to chat,

[21:12] <VCI-Bob> ok - let's look at Jeremiah 25 some more

[21:12] <VCI-Bob> because it is very very significant

[21:12] <called__out-VHL> 10Bob, pre wrath would be good :)

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[21:13] <Tim-VHL> Bob, I was listening to a Rabbi who said that our definition of Apostasy is not the same definition as the one they used when Paul was speaking about it. Do you know anyone who has an old Hebrew dictionary(pre-king james) to confirm this

[21:13] <Rod-VHL> when the antichrist rises a peace will come across the world for 3 1/2 years then all hell will break loose on earth

[21:13] <VCI-Bob> ok - hold the other questions for a minute while I paste some verses

[21:13] <VCI-Bob> This whole country will become a desolate wasteland, and these nations will serve the king of Babylon seventy years. (Jeremiah 25:11 NIV)

[21:13] <VCI-Bob> "But when the seventy years are fulfilled, I will punish the king of Babylon and his nation, the land of the Babylonians, for their guilt," declares the LORD, "and will make it desolate forever. (Jeremiah 25:12 NIV)

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[21:14] <VCI-Bob> this was fulfilled in the time of Daniel.... but....

[21:14] <light2-VHL> Yes and so far Babylon is not desolate

[21:14] <Tim-VHL> Now, that has happened already

[21:14] <VCI-Bob> I will bring upon that land all the things I have spoken against it, all that are written in this book and prophesied by Jeremiah against all the nations. (Jeremiah 25:13 NIV)

[21:14] <VCI-Bob> They themselves will be enslaved by many nations and great kings; I will repay them according to their deeds and the work of their hands." (Jeremiah 25:14 NIV)

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[21:14] <light2-VHL> Also I want to show that verse in the kjv

[21:15] <VCI-Bob> v 14 seems to speak of the future time of exile after 70 AD

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[21:15] <Tim-VHL> Babylon was crushed but it was Israel that was to become and did become a waste land

[21:15] <VCI-Bob> "enslaved by many nations"

[21:15] <VCI-Bob> and what comes next...

[21:15] <VCI-Bob> is certainly end-time prophecy:

[21:15] <light2-VHL> And it shall come to pass, when seventy years are accomplished, that I will punish the king of Babylon, and that nation, saith the LORD, for their iniquity, and the land of the Chaldeans, and will make it perpetual desolations.

[21:15] <farrell-VHL178> 2Bob, do you think the "tribulation" and God's wrath being poured out are two separate events. One relating to Israel and the other to the nations?

[21:16] <light2-VHL> Jer 25:12

[21:16] <VCI-Bob> This is what the LORD, the God of Israel, said to me: "Take from my hand this cup filled with the wine of my wrath and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. (Jeremiah 25:15 NIV)

[21:16] <VCI-Bob> When they drink it, they will stagger and go mad because of the sword I will send among them." (Jeremiah 25:16 NIV)

[21:16] <VCI-Bob> Revelation repeats this theme of the "cup of God's wrath"

[21:16] <Sarah-VHL> 6I don't want the Lord's wrath!

[21:16] <VCI-Bob> but Jeremiah describes it in detail

[21:16] <light2-VHL> Yes and that cup is same as referred to in Rev

[21:16] <VCI-Bob> right

[21:16] <light2-VHL> The Nations are all made to drink it

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> So I took the cup from the Lord's hand and made all the nations to whom he sent me drink it: (Jeremiah 25:17 NIV)

[21:17] <Debi-VHL> Bob, a snyopsis of the desolation of Bablyon in Rev. 18 reads like this, As they watch her burning from afar, merchants and ship captains will cruy out in dismay. Modern-day Irag occupies the location of ancient Babylon. With great military power and large oil reserves, Irag is ideally suited to become a vas commercial power that may figure prominently in the fulfillment of this prophecy in the future.

[21:17] <EZGuest5> For you have not been appointed to endure wrath, but to receive salvation through Christ Jesus

[21:17] <EZGuest5> 1 Thes 5:9

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> Jerusalem and the towns of Judah, its kings and officials, to make them a ruin and an object of horror and scorn and cursing, as they are today; (Jeremiah 25:18 NIV)

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> Pharaoh king of Egypt, his attendants, his officials and all his people, (Jeremiah 25:19 NIV)

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> and all the foreign people there; all the kings of Uz; all the kings of the Philistines (those of Ashkelon, Gaza, Ekron, and the people left at Ashdod); (Jeremiah 25:20 NIV)

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> Edom, Moab and Ammon; (Jeremiah 25:21 NIV)

[21:17] <Tim-VHL> Bob, if this Rabbi is correct, the word apostasy before King James meant rapture. It all depended on which Greek word they used

[21:17] <Rod-VHL> in the old testement it is the city of babylon that is destroyed but revelations it is the nation of babylon that is destroyed

[21:17] <Sarah-VHL> 6my eyes can't keep up!

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> This is speaking of the wrath of God poured on all the nations

[21:17] <EZGuest5> Edom Moad Ammon = Jordan

[21:17] <Sarah-VHL> 6:-)

[21:17] <VCI-Bob> I know Sarah :)

[21:17] <light2-VHL> Then verses 17-25 list all the nations

[21:18] <VCI-Bob> all the kings of Tyre and Sidon; the kings of the coastlands across the sea; (Jeremiah 25:22 NIV)

[21:18] <VCI-Bob> Dedan, Tema, Buz and all who are in distant places ; (Jeremiah 25:23 NIV)

[21:18] <VCI-Bob> all the kings of Arabia and all the kings of the foreign people who live in the desert; (Jeremiah 25:24 NIV)

[21:18] <VCI-Bob> all the kings of Zimri, Elam and Media; (Jeremiah 25:25 NIV)

[21:18] <dovecry-VHL> ok slow down. I know I'm going to have to read the transcripts now:-)

[21:18] <VCI-Bob> and all the kings of the north, near and far, one after the other--all the kingdoms on the face of the earth. And after all of them, the king of Sheshach will drink it too. (Jeremiah 25:26 NIV)

[21:18] <Tim-VHL> VHL has an interesting section on Babylon the Great. Would you believe that it could be the USA

[21:18] <light2-VHL> Also the King of Sheshach refers to the King of Babylon

[21:19] <VCI-Bob> I would encourage you to read Jeremiah 25 on your own and see how it ties into Revelation

[21:19] <light2-VHL> Now read verse 27

[21:19] <Rod-VHL> i fear that you are right i think babylon is the usa

[21:19] <farrell-VHL178> 2Will do, thanks :)

[21:19] <VCI-Bob> here is that part that speaks of the coming of the Lord:

[21:19] <light2-VHL> Once these nations fall they rise no more

[21:19] <VCI-Bob> "Now prophesy all these words against them and say to them: "'The LORD will roar from on high; he will thunder from his holy dwelling and roar mightily against his land. He will shout like those who tread the grapes, shout against all who live on the earth. (Jeremiah 25:30 NIV)

[21:19] <VCI-Bob> The tumult will resound to the ends of the earth, for the LORD will bring charges against the nations; he will bring judgment on all mankind and put the wicked to the sword,'" declares the LORD. (Jeremiah 25:31 NIV)

[21:19] <called__out-VHL> 10I disagree Rod, I think Babylon is going to be rebuilt in Iraq

[21:19] <EZGuest5> People fail to realize the precision of Bible prophecy. It is precise when taken literally. When we take prophecy literally the bible teaches that the Antichrist will rise out of Syria

[21:20] <Judy-VHL> 5Hello DonB.

[21:20] <VCI-Bob> Where does it say that, EZ5?

[21:20] <Rod-VHL> we will have to wait and see

[21:20] <called__out-VHL> 10Yes, Rod :)

[21:20] <EZGuest5> Chapter 8 of Daniel and Chapter 11 of Daniel as

[21:20] <VCI-Bob> I have heard that before, but don't know where it says "Syria"

[21:20] <Judy-VHL> 5I don't know called out.......just heard a christian radio program.....a week long......discussing that the US is the Mystery Babylon.

[21:21] <DonB-VHL> 14hi Judy

[21:21] <Tim-VHL> According to the Bible, the anti-christ comes from a place with 7 hills

[21:21] <Sarah-VHL> 6Syria is Amon, isn't it?

[21:21] <Rod-VHL> but i cannot see where would the support come from and the money

[21:21] <called__out-VHL> 10Yea Judy, but I think the USA will play a very small role in the end time

[21:21] <VCI-Bob> no, Ammon is present day Jordan

[21:21] <Tim-VHL> The most logical place with 7 hills is Rome

[21:21] <VCI-Bob> Amman = Ammon (the capital of Jordan)

[21:21] <EZGuest5> "out of one of them" (Syria ,Egypt,Turkey, Greece) Then in chapter 111 it narrows it down to the king of the North "Syria"

[21:21] <Judy-VHL> 5US is dealt with in Jeremiah, I know.

[21:21] <light2-VHL> Therefore prophesy thou against them all these words, and say unto them, The LORD shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout, as they that tread the grapes, against all the inhabitants of the earth.

[21:21] <EZGuest5> in versus 11:36-45

[21:22] <Tim-VHL> the USA gets a real bang out of the whole thing

[21:22] <called__out-VHL> 10I didn't know that Judy :)

[21:22] <VCI-Bob> EZ5, that's a matter of interpretation that "Syria" is the "King of the North"

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[21:22] <VCI-Bob> it does not say that

[21:22] <light2-VHL> Jer 25:30

[21:22] <Sarah-VHL> 6So what word is Syria? :-)

[21:22] <EZGuest5> notice that the prevailing charactariastic in Rev 13 of the antichrist and his empire is "leopardlike" or Greecian

[21:22] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Missy

[21:22] <Judy-VHL> 5Yeah.......young cubs mean Canada, US, Australia..............

[21:22] <Judy-VHL> 5All from Mother England.

[21:23] <Tim-VHL> could there be two Babylon's, one city and another a nation?

[21:23] <dovecry-VHL> I agree, even if I don't understand it all but I believe it's Rome too

[21:23] <EZGuest5> Greecian = Turkey, Syria, Greece, and Egypt

[21:23] <light2-VHL> I read where leopard like is African

[21:23] <EZGuest5> no read in chapter 7 of Daniel the leopard is Greece

[21:23] <VCI-Bob> that was speaking of Alexanders empire being parceled out to 4 of his generals

[21:23] <Sarah-VHL> 6Tim, i just read what you wrote....bad pun! :-)

[21:23] <Tim-VHL> the leopard is Alexander the Great

[21:24] <EZGuest5> the same as the Goat of chapter 8 with 4 horns or turkey Syria Greece and Egypt

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[21:24] <Rod-VHL> well all i Know is niagara falls canada is quiet tonight

[21:24] <Judy-VHL> 5The author of the book that discusses US as Mystery Babylon says there is more than one Babylong referred to in the Bible.

[21:24] <VCI-Bob> that's good, Rod :)

[21:24] <EZGuest5> Alexander the great of the greecian empire

[21:24] <Sarah-VHL> 6lol

[21:24] <light2-VHL> Yes Tim I think that there are and that they join forces for a short time

[21:24] <EZGuest5> now we are getting somewhere

[21:24] <Tim-VHL> I am sorry, I am a disabled vet who is just embarrassed to be an American right now

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[21:25] <light2-VHL> until the political babylon kills the whore the spiritual babylon

[21:25] <Sarah-VHL> 6Tim, I am proud of you

[21:25] <VCI-Bob> remember, that we cannot be dogmatic about details of Bible prophecy - some things are just not that clear yet

[21:25] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Amen, Bob

[21:25] <Tim-VHL> Mam, why would you be proud of me?

[21:25] <VCI-Bob> and what is important is not that we have a whole system worked out....

[21:25] <EZGuest5> Bob, I disagree with all do respect of course

[21:25] <VCI-Bob> but that we are longing for the appearance of Jesus

[21:25] <light2-VHL> Well one thing that is very clear, is that Romes seven hills were once each dedicated to a temple of a God

[21:26] <VCI-Bob> ok, EZ :)

[21:26] <dovecry-VHL> Yes I too don't want to admit to being american

[21:26] <Sarah-VHL> 6You gave of yourself so I can sit here and chat. I am proud of you.

[21:26] <light2-VHL> And that the priesthood and practices of the Catholic Church are pagan

[21:26] <sunshine-VHL> +Me to Tim... VERY VERY proud of you.

[21:26] <Rod-VHL> Lord I will endure forever with my whole heart

[21:26] <Tim-VHL> Thank you Mam, I do appreciate that

[21:26] <called__out-VHL> 10I am proud of you too Tim :)

[21:26] <EZGuest5> Bob, do you have any literal bible prophecy teachings from Finis Dake or Clarence Larkin?

[21:26] <VCI-Bob> :)

[21:27] <VCI-Bob> I have read both of their writings before, yes

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[21:27] <Judy-VHL> 5Well, I for one AM proud to be an American........but I also am disolussioned by my country's leaders.

[21:27] <Judy-VHL> 5It is still the best place to live.

[21:27] <EZGuest5> the only possible outcome is Syria, without Syria all of them are void of fulfillment

[21:27] <Sarah-VHL> 6You hit the nail on the head for me on that, Judy!

[21:27] <Rod-VHL> can we talk about the144,000

[21:27] <Perpetua-VHL> How much of this will we see? How much of this happens after the rapture of His Church?

[21:27] <farrell-VHL111> 2Gran isn't here tonight and may not be feeling well. Would you all remember to pray for her? :)

[21:27] <Judy-VHL> 5Good, Sarah.

[21:28] <called__out-VHL> 10Me too Judy, amen...we have our faults, but we are living in bad times.

[21:28] <DonB-VHL> 14amen..............Judy

[21:28] <Tim-VHL> Let me ask a question: ! Thessalonians 5 says that Jesus will come like a thief in the night. But I am of the day, so He won't come like a thief for me? Do you agree with this?

[21:28] <VCI-Bob> Perpet, if one subscribes to the pre-trib position, then much if this will occur after we are gone

[21:28] <farrell-VHL111> 2I am having trouble staying connected. I love you brothers and sisters. Good night and God Bless

[21:28] <Bezalel-VHL> 2She wasn't here last night, either, Farrell. Yes, we need to be sure and pray for Gran

[21:28] <dovecry-VHL> Yes and our leaders are taking us down with themselvews. I for one don't even want to be assoiated with them

[21:28] <Kathy-VHL> Remember those in power are there only because God wants themn there

[21:28] <VCI-Bob> yes, Tim

[21:28] <Sarah-VHL> 6goodnight Farrell

[21:28] <VCI-Bob> Night, Farrell :) See ya next time

[21:29] <dovecry-VHL> Loev farrell

[21:29] <Sarah-VHL> 6good point Kathy

[21:29] <dovecry-VHL> :-)

[21:29] <light2-VHL> nite farrell and we will remember Gran too

[21:29] <Tim-VHL> Bob, why do the Christian churches teach just the opposite

[21:29] <Kathy-VHL> It is all part of Gods big plan they have to be the kind of leaders they are to fulfill what God has said

[21:29] <sunshine-VHL> I dont agreee .

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[21:29] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bob, isn't that what the intro mentioned? If Arafat was like Pharoah?

[21:30] <Tim-VHL> What don't you agree with sunshine?

[21:30] <VCI-Bob> Tim, it seems that more people are moving away from the pre-trib position after taking a look at the Scriptures for themselves, rather than what they have been taught

[21:30] <Judy-VHL> 5Goodnight Farrell.

[21:30] <Bezalel-VHL> 2:-)Bob

[21:30] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Sarah - God is going to display His glory

[21:30] <Shira-VHL> We are coming up on the 9th of Av which falls on August 10th this year, does anyone think that might be significant?

[21:30] <VCI-Bob> through the defiance of those who refuse to bow to Him

[21:30] <fran-VHL> 3hi Judy

[21:31] <VCI-Bob> I was wondering that also, Shira - we'll see :)

[21:31] <sunshine-VHL> That corrupt people are Gods will for his plan.

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[21:31] <Tim-VHL> I am under extreme scrutiny with the church I used to go too right now because I mentioned that in a Sunday school

[21:31] <Sarah-VHL> 6Please share, Bob?

[21:31] <Perpetua-VHL> The 9th of AV?

[21:31] <Judy-VHL> 5Kathy.........yes, that is true. All is going according to plan. In order to have a NWO.....we must have politicians who are globalists.

[21:31] <Cephas-VHL> 4Bob, are you mid-trib?

[21:31] <Judy-VHL> 5Hey Fran!

[21:31] <Kathy-VHL> right Judy

[21:31] <VCI-Bob> yes, Tim, in some churches, the theological police will nab you if you are not pre-trib :)

[21:31] <light2-VHL> Yes because God uses the enemies of Israel to punish them, or did in times past

[21:32] <VCI-Bob> The 9th of AV...

[21:32] <VCI-Bob> is the date when both temples were destroyed

[21:32] <VCI-Bob> and numerous other bad things happened to the Jewish people on that date

[21:32] <Perpetua-VHL> What does it stand for? (AV)

[21:32] <Judy-VHL> 5Bob..........LOL.....theological police!!

[21:32] <VCI-Bob> it's a month

[21:32] <Sarah-VHL> 6Isn't that the day they were first allowed to return to Israel, once a year or something?

[21:33] <Tim-VHL> that is coming up very soon

[21:33] <Judy-VHL> 5;-)

[21:33] <VCI-Bob> :)

[21:33] <dovecry-VHL> well everyone I must go too, Thank you all for being patient with me.

[21:33] <Bezalel-VHL> 2O-O (Handcuffs)

[21:33] <EZGuest5> :)

[21:33] <VCI-Bob> See ya dovecry - thanks for being here again

[21:33] <Perpetua-VHL> We are on our knees for you Dove

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[21:33] <VCI-Bob> :) Bez

[21:33] <Judy-VHL> 5Hey Dove, I love you and be good!

[21:33] <Sarah-VHL> 6Be Blessed Dovecry!

[21:33] <Tim-VHL> right that is the day that the Jews were allowed to return to jerusalem so that they could celebrate or mourn the destruction of their Temple

[21:33] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Night Dovecry, we'll keep the prayers going:-*

[21:33] <VCI-Bob> yes...

[21:34] <VCI-Bob> when the Romans banished the Jews from Jerusalem after 132 AD...

[21:34] <VCI-Bob> they did allow them to come back one day a year

[21:34] <dovecry-VHL> I will read the scripts .My keyboard is crying thank you all. keep smiling

[21:34] <Sarah-VHL> 6{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Dovecry}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

[21:34] <dovecry-VHL> I love you too Shalom

[21:34] <Tim-VHL> It was a rub dirt in your face tradition

[21:35] <light2-VHL> God Bless Dovecry

[21:35] <VCI-Bob> right, Tim, exactly

[21:35] <Sarah-VHL> 6Nice people, those Romans

[21:35] <Sarah-VHL> 6NOT

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[21:35] <dovecry-VHL> You are all so special to me Thank You my Jesus fro my friends

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[21:35] <VCI-Bob> yer special yerself, Dove :)

[21:35] <Perpetua-VHL> So on the modern calendar what date is 9th AV?

[21:35] <VCI-Bob> August 10 this year, I believe

[21:35] <dovecry-VHL> good nite now:-*

[21:36] <VCI-Bob> it differs each year

[21:36] <Tim-VHL> it is still part of a Jewish festival known as 3 weeks

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[21:36] <Sarah-VHL> 6Oh, bummer, day after my birthday :-(

[21:36] <Perpetua-VHL> What do you think could happen?

[21:36] <Judy-VHL> 5Early Happy Birthday Sarah!

[21:36] <light2-VHL> Yes and I was thinking I wonder why they call the month Tammuz, since this was a god

[21:36] <Sarah-VHL> 6Thanks, Judy

[21:36] <Cephas-VHL> 4Is it an accident that JERUSALEM --HAS U S A RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE?

[21:37] <VCI-Bob> who knows? we can only speculate such things, so we are better off sticking to what we know will happen

[21:37] <Perpetua-VHL> I am embarrassed to know so little about Jewish traditions

[21:37] <VCI-Bob> probably, Cephas :)

[21:37] <Tim-VHL> Why did Constantine create December 25 as Jesus birthday and name the day Jesus rose from the dead after the mother of the sun god, Ishtar(English translation Easter)

[21:37] <light2-VHL> I don't think anything happens by accident

[21:37] <Cephas-VHL> 4Just a thought

[21:38] <Judy-VHL> 5Perpetua.......I join you in that. I do not know much at all about the Feasts or customs.

[21:38] <Sarah-VHL> 6Co-incident. Some try to use that to say the USA is God's Chosen People.

[21:38] <light2-VHL> Because he was not a true Christian probably, Tim

[21:38] <Perpetua-VHL> ;-)

[21:38] <Tim-VHL> Christmas, Lent and Easter are pagan holidays

[21:38] <Kathy-VHL> he wanted to attract all beliefs to christianity like the Pope is trying to do

[21:38] <light2-VHL> Amen Roman pagan holidays

[21:38] <Shira-VHL> He was trying to appease the heathen masses who had converted to christianity

[21:39] <Kathy-VHL> He wanted to bend it to make it attractive

[21:39] <Sarah-VHL> 6Yeah, but I celebrate Jesus on Christmas and Easter!

[21:39] <Tim-VHL> actually they are part of the Mithra religion

[21:39] <Judy-VHL> 5Sarah, not His Chosen, but certainly a blessed nation............but that is all changing.

[21:39] <VCI-Bob> yes, Tim - however.. .not everyone who celebrates them in good conscence is a "pagan" :)

[21:39] <light2-VHL> Yes even some of the gods of the day were renamed saints

[21:39] <light2-VHL> Like Saint Dionysius

[21:39] <Sarah-VHL> 6I thought Christmas was placed to co-incide with Channukah as much as possible?

[21:40] <Sarah-VHL> 6And Easter was to match Passover

[21:40] <light2-VHL> And you know Rome encourages all to pray to the "Saints"

[21:40] <Tim-VHL> agreed, God does not need substitutes for His Festivals. He has three already to go

[21:40] <Shira-VHL> The Jewish feasts are "The Feasts of the Lord" shouldn't we be celebrating them?

[21:40] <called__out-VHL> My sheep know my voice, God knows who belongs to him.

[21:40] <Tim-VHL> No, Easter was to match the day the sun god rose from the dead at sunrise

[21:41] <VCI-Bob> ok - let's move on - we have not gotten to Isaiah 24-26 yet :)

[21:41] <Cephas-VHL> 4Have any of you read the journals of columbus and his thoughts on how God was leading him to someplace special?

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[21:41] <light2-VHL> Yes called and he also says let them that are Christs, depart from evil

[21:41] <VCI-Bob> nope, Cephas

[21:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6Isaiah 24?

[21:41] <grizz-VHL> shalom my friends:->:-):-):-)

[21:41] <VCI-Bob> that was the "assigned reading" for the chat :)

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[21:41] <light2-VHL> hey grizzman

[21:41] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Grizz!

[21:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6Hi Grizz!

[21:41] <Kathy-VHL> Hi Grizz

[21:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6oh, I didn't know the assignment.

[21:42] <Rod-VHL> how does one paste in this chat window ??

[21:42] <VCI-Bob> Ctrl C to copy, Ctrl V to paste

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[21:42] <Cephas-VHL> 4columbus quotes often from Isa. and how God was leading him to a new promise land!

[21:42] <Rod-VHL> thankyou

[21:42] <Perpetua-VHL> Does anyone else keep getting booted off?

[21:43] <called__out-VHL> yes I do Perpetua

[21:43] <VCI-Bob> sorry, Perpet - it happens from time to time

[21:43] <Sarah-VHL> 6We still like you!

[21:43] <Perpetua-VHL> its okay thanks

[21:43] <missy-VHL> where can you find that out about columbus i told a friend and he didnt believe me but i dont hknow where to look any help?

[21:43] <Perpetua-VHL> Grizz - interesting name where did you get it?

[21:43] <Tim-VHL> Isaiah 24:5 because they transgressed the teachings, changed the lawand broke the everlasting covenant

[21:43] <EZGuest5> Beht(2) Ah-leph(1) Seen(300) Hei(5) Ah-leph(1) Rehsh(200) Ah-leph(1) Lah-med(30) Ah-leph(1) Sah-mekh(60) Sah-Mekh(60) Ah-leph(1) Dah-let(4) Do the math real quick on this one!

[21:43] <VCI-Bob> ok - should we proceed to Isaiah?

[21:44] <VCI-Bob> What is that, EZ?

[21:44] <called__out-VHL> please do Bob

[21:44] <Tim-VHL> isn't the church guilty of this right now?

[21:44] <Judy-VHL> 5Yes, Bob.:-*

[21:44] <EZGuest5> Add it up?

[21:44] <VCI-Bob> ok, here we go

[21:44] <grizz-VHL> use to be mystreet name in the old days really its grizzman

[21:44] <VCI-Bob> Isaiah 24 is a vision that he had

[21:44] <VCI-Bob> of the earth in the end times, during the day of the Lord

[21:44] <Tim-VHL> why has the church thrown out Torah?

[21:45] <Cephas-VHL> 4type in writings of columbus and click on search

[21:45] <Perpetua-VHL> Oh - I just knew someone a Very long time ago that went by that nickname.

[21:45] <missy-VHL> thank you!

[21:45] <Judy-VHL> 5I'm listening Bob.........

[21:45] <Sarah-VHL> 6What vision, Bob?

[21:45] <Cephas-VHL> 4welcome

[21:45] <VCI-Bob> I'm going to paste, and then we'll discuss

[21:45] <VCI-Bob> a few verses at a time

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> See, the LORD is going to lay waste the earth and devastate it; he will ruin its face and scatter its inhabitants-- (Isaiah 24:1 NIV)

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> it will be the same for priest as for people, for master as for servant, for mistress as for maid, for seller as for buyer, for borrower as for lender, for debtor as for creditor. (Isaiah 24:2 NIV)

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> The earth will be completely laid waste and totally plundered. The LORD has spoken this word. (Isaiah 24:3 NIV)

[21:46] <EZGuest5> Bob, did you add it up?

[21:46] <Tim-VHL> start pasting Good Sir

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> no, EZ

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> ok - this is the intro

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[21:46] <Judy-VHL> 5 666 EZ

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[21:46] <VCI-Bob> what do we see here?

[21:46] <EZGuest5> yes you are right

[21:46] <Sarah-VHL> 6God is an equal opportunity punisher?

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> waste and ruin

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> yeah, Sarah :)

[21:46] <Bezalel-VHL> 2We're all subject to judgement and wrath

[21:46] <VCI-Bob> good

[21:46] <EZGuest5> Bashar Al-Assad in Hebrew

[21:47] <Tim-VHL> the complete and total destruction of Israel by Babylon

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[21:47] <VCI-Bob> no, Tim, this is speaking of the world being judged

[21:47] <Tim-VHL> That is what Ezra and Nehemiah found

[21:47] <Sarah-VHL> 6Us too?

[21:48] <VCI-Bob> you will see many expressions of global, planetary judgment here

[21:48] <VCI-Bob> are we "the world"? :) no

[21:48] <Sarah-VHL> 6:-)

[21:48] <Judy-VHL> 5Completely and totally

[21:48] <Tim-VHL> ok if we want to go that way, then I would conclude that rapture has already happened

[21:48] <VCI-Bob> The earth dries up and withers, the world languishes and withers, the exalted of the earth languish. (Isaiah 24:4 NIV)

[21:48] <VCI-Bob> The earth is defiled by its people; they have disobeyed the laws, violated the statutes and broken the everlasting covenant. (Isaiah 24:5 NIV)

[21:48] <VCI-Bob> Therefore a curse consumes the earth; its people must bear their guilt. Therefore earth's inhabitants are burned up, and very few are left. (Isaiah 24:6 NIV)

[21:49] <Judy-VHL> 5Oh Tim..........not so.

[21:49] <VCI-Bob> Here it gives some reasons

[21:49] <VCI-Bob> remember, this is the same things that John saw in Revelations

[21:49] <Cephas-VHL> 4must leave; peace to you all

[21:49] <VCI-Bob> See ya Cephas

[21:49] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Night Cephas

[21:49] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bye Cephas

[21:49] <Judy-VHL> 5Night Cephas

[21:50] <VCI-Bob> the earth is "defiled"

[21:50] <VCI-Bob> because of disobedience to God's laws

[21:50] <Tim-VHL> I will prove that in a minute

[21:50] <Sarah-VHL> 6Listening, Bob

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[21:50] <VCI-Bob> next section is "the party is over"

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> The new wine dries up and the vine withers; all the merrymakers groan. (Isaiah 24:7 NIV)

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> The gaiety of the tambourines is stilled, the noise of the revelers has stopped, the joyful harp is silent. (Isaiah 24:8 NIV)

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> No longer do they drink wine with a song; the beer is bitter to its drinkers. (Isaiah 24:9 NIV)

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> The ruined city lies desolate; the entrance to every house is barred. (Isaiah 24:10 NIV)

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> In the streets they cry out for wine; all joy turns to gloom, all gaiety is banished from the earth. (Isaiah 24:11 NIV)

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> this is vivid picture - all of the people who live to party

[21:51] <VCI-Bob> are not partying anymore

[21:51] <EZGuest5> Judy, you just added the number of the new Syrian President Bashar Al-Assad in Hebrew in fulfillment of the eigth chapter of Daniel as well as the 11th chapter versus 36-45 and also Revelation 13:18 as well as the predominant feature being leopard like "Greecian"

[21:52] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Bob, Is the ruined city Damascus?

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[21:52] <VCI-Bob> in this case, the ruined city...

[21:52] <VCI-Bob> is every city on the planet

[21:52] <Judy-VHL> 5I got you EZ......interesting.

[21:52] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Thanks

[21:52] <Tim-VHL> 2 Thessalonians 2:5 and you know what is restraining, so that he may be revealedin his own time.For already this separating of the Lawis at work secretly, butuntil He who is restraining is out of the way. Then the one who embodiesseparation from the lawwill be revealed

[21:53] <VCI-Bob> The city is left in ruins, its gate is battered to pieces. (Isaiah 24:12 NIV)

[21:53] <VCI-Bob> So will it be on the earth and among the nations, as when an olive tree is beaten, or as when gleanings are left after the grape harvest. (Isaiah 24:13 NIV)

[21:53] <DonB-VHL> 14Not only the people suffered from their sins; even the land suffered the effects of evil and lawbreaking. Today we see the results of sin in our own land: pollution, crime, addiction, poverty. Sin affects every aspect of society so extensively that even those faithful to God suffer.

[21:53] <Sarah-VHL> 6Interesting symbolism with the olive tree and grapes there

[21:53] <VCI-Bob> yes, Sarah

[21:53] <Judy-VHL> 5Amen Don

[21:54] <Sarah-VHL> 6does that mean trials for us?

[21:54] <VCI-Bob> but suddenly.... a change in tone....

[21:54] <Tim-VHL> why olives and grapes

[21:54] <VCI-Bob> it's a picture, Tim, that the reader would understand

[21:54] <DonB-VHL> 14We cannot blame God for these conditions because sin has brought them about. The more we who are believers renounce sin, speak against immoral practices, and share God's Word with others, the more we slow our society's deterioration. We must not give up: Sin is rampant, but we can make a difference.

[21:54] <VCI-Bob> not much was left - just a little

[21:55] <VCI-Bob> like after you beat a tree to get the olives out

[21:55] <VCI-Bob> that's what the earth will be like

[21:55] <VCI-Bob> ok - now the change in tone...

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[21:58] <Sarah-VHL> 6There he is!

[21:58] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Yup, Sarah, looks like he's back now!

[21:58] <called__out-VHL> yes, I think he did :-(

[21:58] <VCI-Bob> got tossed out :)

[21:58] <called__out-VHL> good :)

[21:58] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bad computer! BAD! BAD!

[21:58] <called__out-VHL> bad ole computer

[21:58] <Judy-VHL> 5LOL

[21:58] <VCI-Bob> LOL

[21:58] <Sarah-VHL> 6Glad you are back!

[21:58] <called__out-VHL> lol

[21:58] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Thought you were out looking for Perpetua...

[21:58] <Tim-VHL> annoint that computer now

[21:58] <VCI-Bob> ok, back to Isaiah

[21:58] <Judy-VHL> 5Satan is trying his best.......

[21:58] <VCI-Bob> thanks :)

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> it's brand new :) just installed it today

[21:59] <Sarah-VHL> 6Satan's best isn't good enough cause JESUS is the best!

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> ok - as I was saying, a sudden change in tone

[21:59] <Tim-VHL> haven't got the demons out of it yet huh?

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> that is VERY relevant to us:

[21:59] <Bezalel-VHL> 2PC's too fast for the Internet, huh, Bob?

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> They raise their voices, they shout for joy; from the west they acclaim the Lord's majesty. (Isaiah 24:14 NIV)

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> Therefore in the east give glory to the LORD; exalt the name of the LORD, the God of Israel, in the islands of the sea. (Isaiah 24:15 NIV)

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> From the ends of the earth we hear singing: "Glory to the Righteous One." But I said, "I waste away, I waste away! Woe to me! The treacherous betray! With treachery the treacherous betray!" (Isaiah 24:16 NIV)

[21:59] <VCI-Bob> remember, so far we had seen the devestation of the earth....

[22:00] <VCI-Bob> but now, of a sudden, in the midst of this destruction.... - singing!!!

[22:00] <Sarah-VHL> 6Someone is coming?

[22:00] <VCI-Bob> that's us, folks :)

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[22:00] <called__out-VHL> WE are singing?

[22:00] <VCI-Bob> we are glorifying God because we see what is happening

[22:00] <Sarah-VHL> 6This is AFTER the destruction, right?

[22:01] <VCI-Bob> and exalting His name because He is showing His greatness

[22:01] <called__out-VHL> But how can we live thru all that destruction

[22:01] <VCI-Bob> no, in the middle of it

[22:01] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Any connection with the choir in Heaven from Revelations?

[22:01] <VCI-Bob> I don't know "how"

[22:01] <Sarah-VHL> 6We rejoice while the bad guys are getting beaten up?

[22:01] <VCI-Bob> we rejoice because God is displaying His power and glory

[22:02] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Amen, Bob

[22:02] <VCI-Bob> (see Psalm 46) (later)

[22:02] <Judy-VHL> 5Of course I am pre trib.......so I don't think we go through it at all. My opinion.

[22:02] <called__out-VHL> That makes more sense to me Judy.

[22:02] <VCI-Bob> ok, Judy :) well, someone here is singing in the middle of all this chaos on the earth :)

[22:02] <Sarah-VHL> 6Yeah, God is getting revenge, right?

[22:02] <VCI-Bob> right

[22:02] <Tim-VHL> I am pre-trib because of 2 Thess 2

[22:03] <VCI-Bob> I am post trib because of 2 Thess 2 - but let's not discuss that now :)

[22:03] <VCI-Bob> note v 16

[22:03] <Rod-VHL> Endure forever goodnight God Bless

[22:03] <VCI-Bob> From the ends of the earth we hear singing: "Glory to the Righteous One." But I said, "I waste away, I waste away! Woe to me! The treacherous betray! With treachery the treacherous betray!" (Isaiah 24:16 NIV)

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[22:03] <Tim-VHL> You are the first one to agree with me in writing. Most people tell me I am nuts

[22:04] <VCI-Bob> This brings to mind the words of Jesus that in those days many would betray each other

[22:04] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Night Rod

[22:04] <Sarah-VHL> 6Goodnight Rod

[22:04] <Tim-VHL> night Rod

[22:04] <Sarah-VHL> 6Why is Isaiah upset when we are singing?

[22:04] <VCI-Bob> So... what we see in those verses - is the believers who are here

[22:04] <Tim-VHL> how can you be post-trib with 2 thess 2?????

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[22:05] <VCI-Bob> Isaiah is speaking on behalf of the believers there

[22:05] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, hawk :)

[22:05] <Sarah-VHL> 6confused

[22:05] <VCI-Bob> 1st person - as if he were a participant

[22:05] <Sarah-VHL> 6Some believers are rejoicing and some are not

[22:05] <hawk-VHL> Hello Bob

[22:05] <Perpetua-VHL> I'm glad I'm not alone there Sarah

[22:05] <VCI-Bob> they are rejoicing because of God showing his greatness..

[22:06] <VCI-Bob> but remember what else is happening at this time - the ac has declared war against all believers

[22:06] <Sarah-VHL> 6and upset because?

[22:06] <VCI-Bob> ?

[22:06] <Tim-VHL> that's why the church develops a split personality

[22:06] <Sarah-VHL> 6I asked first? LOL

[22:07] <VCI-Bob> because they are being pursued to death by the forces of the ac

[22:07] <called__out-VHL> God fights the battle for us!!

[22:07] <Tim-VHL> the ac is running the church because he has made himself god

[22:07] <VCI-Bob> and many are being martyred

[22:07] <Sarah-VHL> 6ok.

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[22:07] <Tim-VHL> guilotined

[22:07] <Sarah-VHL> 6I get it

[22:07] <called__out-VHL> We finally see the ac destroyed?

[22:07] <VCI-Bob> and next...

[22:07] <VCI-Bob> in response... to the "people of the earth" massacring the saints...

[22:08] <VCI-Bob> Terror and pit and snare await you, O people of the earth. (Isaiah 24:17 NIV)

[22:08] <VCI-Bob> Whoever flees at the sound of terror will fall into a pit; whoever climbs out of the pit will be caught in a snare. The floodgates of the heavens are opened, the foundations of the earth shake. (Isaiah 24:18 NIV)

[22:08] <VCI-Bob> The earth is broken up, the earth is split asunder, the earth is thoroughly shaken. (Isaiah 24:19 NIV)

[22:08] <VCI-Bob> The earth reels like a drunkard, it sways like a hut in the wind; so heavy upon it is the guilt of its rebellion that it falls--never to rise again. (Isaiah 24:20 NIV)

[22:08] <Tim-VHL> Bob, in Revelation, the martyred people are pressuring God for justice and He tells them to be patient

[22:09] <VCI-Bob> Right, Tim, the ones already killed ask "how long will this go one" and He replies

[22:09] <VCI-Bob> until the number that are to be killed as you were is complete

[22:09] <VCI-Bob> go on, that is

[22:09] <Sarah-VHL> 6Does this mean the whole earth is destroyed?

[22:09] <VCI-Bob> it means massive upheaval, Sarah

[22:09] <grizz-VHL> Bob the bible says no one will know for sure which worl leader will be the antichrist until after the HOLY SPIRT is temporarily removed out of the world

[22:09] <VCI-Bob> shaking, reeling

[22:09] <Tim-VHL> you are saying that rapture does not occur until this is over???

[22:10] <VCI-Bob> it does not say that, Grizz, exactly

[22:10] <Tim-VHL> Grizz you are very right. I AGREE

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[22:10] <VCI-Bob> there are difference of opinion on that verse

[22:10] <grizz-VHL> this means i hope we are with HIM

[22:10] <VCI-Bob> I hope so too

[22:10] <VCI-Bob> but I don't see it that way

[22:10] <Sarah-VHL> 6Me three

[22:11] <grizz-VHL> PLEASE EXPLAIN

[22:11] <Sarah-VHL> 6Ok, I am going to go build a shelter....(sigh)

[22:11] <VCI-Bob> look at the vivid pictures here

[22:11] <Kathy-VHL> Well we know it will hapen and if we are taken before good and if we are taken in the mid or end then God will protect

[22:11] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Won't help, Sarah

[22:11] <VCI-Bob> The earth is broken up, the earth is split asunder, the earth is thoroughly shaken. (Isaiah 24:19 NIV)

[22:11] <VCI-Bob> The earth reels like a drunkard, it sways like a hut in the wind; so heavy upon it is the guilt of its rebellion that it falls--never to rise again. (Isaiah 24:20 NIV)

[22:11] <Sarah-VHL> 6Uh, buy a tent?

[22:11] <Tim-VHL> I have been taught and told by a Messianic Rabbi that that verse means the Holy Spirit that is removed is the Bride

[22:11] <Bezalel-VHL> 2And stock up on water!

[22:12] <Kathy-VHL> air balloon might be the best thing lol

[22:12] <VCI-Bob> yes, Tim, that's a common interpretation from the pre-trib position

[22:12] <Sarah-VHL> 6The earth is split asunder sounds like "in two"

[22:12] <Tim-VHL> The Holy Spirit can not completely leave because of the 144,000

[22:12] <VCI-Bob> it "reels" and "sways"

[22:12] <EZGuest5> You pick any man out of the 6 Billion people on the earth and I can give you 50 biblical reasons why he is not the Antichrist yet not one flaw can be presented with Bashar Al-Assad not one

[22:12] <VCI-Bob> and God will "shake it"

[22:13] <Kathy-VHL> I understand the Holy Spirit will kmove at that time like in the Old testament He came and went

[22:13] <grizz-VHL> it says he is temp removed

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[22:13] <Kathy-VHL> He did not indwell

[22:13] <VCI-Bob> EZ, sounds like you are fixated on that a little :)

[22:13] <Tim-VHL> It might be weird aL

[22:13] <Sarah-VHL> 6:-) Tim

[22:13] <EZGuest5> We can either interpret literally or not at all

[22:13] <Tim-VHL> WE HAVE TO COME BACK WHEN yESHUA COMES DOWN TO REIGN

[22:14] <Tim-VHL> SORRY about the letters, may caps lock was on

[22:14] <EZGuest5> I understand that is is profound. But I am not alone

[22:14] <VCI-Bob> Which seems to indicated changes in the earth's orbit that will contribute to the different weather described in other places

[22:14] <EZGuest5> It is based on literal interpretation of bible prophecy

[22:14] <Sarah-VHL> 6Is this the Astroid theory Bob?

[22:14] <incense11> What is

[22:14] <incense11> Hello all

[22:14] <VCI-Bob> EZ, all of us here also take the Bible literally

[22:15] <Sarah-VHL> 6Hi incense 11

[22:15] <Tim-VHL> Hi Sarah, that is weird Al Gore

[22:15] <VCI-Bob> Hello, Incense :)

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[22:15] <Tim-VHL> Hi Incense

[22:15] <EZGuest5> Please understand I am not trying to cause devision

[22:15] <VCI-Bob> We are having a spirited discussion of Isaiah 24 :)

[22:15] <EZGuest5> division

[22:15] <VCI-Bob> ok, EZ :)

[22:15] <VCI-Bob> and we do appreciate the comments - that is interesting

[22:15] <EZGuest5> I just have a burden Pastor Hagee came out and said it on TV

[22:15] <Tim-VHL> If we all agreed we wouldn't be thinking or growing

[22:15] <EZGuest5> after I sent him my research

[22:16] <Sarah-VHL> 6I know Jesus wins!

[22:16] <EZGuest5> 6 months ago

[22:16] <VCI-Bob> Personally, I don't worry too much about who he is

[22:16] <EZGuest5> Well I understand

[22:16] <VCI-Bob> right, Tim

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[22:16] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, 947

[22:16] <Tim-VHL> Sarah, when does that happen?

[22:16] <EZGuest5> but If there was a fox in the hen house you would warn the chickens

[22:16] <VCI-Bob> speaking of "winning"...

[22:16] <Sarah-VHL> 6Jesus wins when He comes back!

[22:16] <VCI-Bob> that leads us to the next verse :)

[22:16] <Sarah-VHL> 6listening, Bob

[22:17] <EZGuest5> What I would really like is to email all of my research to you

[22:17] <VCI-Bob> In that day the LORD will punish the powers in the heavens above and the kings on the earth below. (Isaiah 24:21 NIV)

[22:17] <VCI-Bob> They will be herded together like prisoners bound in a dungeon; they will be shut up in prison and be punished after many days. (Isaiah 24:22 NIV)

[22:17] <VCI-Bob> EZ, why not post on the VHL forums?

[22:17] <Tim-VHL> Bob, you tell one time when God did not warn His people personally when the trials like you describe will come

[22:17] <EZGuest5> I have it in word Format eith pictures and exhaustive bible passages

[22:17] <VCI-Bob> He HAS warned us Tim, amply

[22:17] <EZGuest5> it is 40 pages long in a 10 point font

[22:18] <EZGuest5> with in depth hebrew explainations

[22:18] <VCI-Bob> OK - what is happening in v 21-22

[22:18] <VCI-Bob> oh, that's too much to post, EZ5

[22:18] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bob, this is a warning in Isaiah, isn't it?

[22:18] <Tim-VHL> The first century Christians knew exactly what they were facing and when it was going to happen

[22:18] <Cephas-VHL> 4http://usasn.com/-lbt/columbus.html

[22:18] <VCI-Bob> Tim, that's why we look into Bible prophecy, among other reasons :)

[22:19] <Cephas-VHL> 4click on to this site to find out about chris and the usa

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[22:19] <VCI-Bob> Welcome, Bee

[22:19] <Cephas-VHL> 4peace to you all

[22:19] <Tim-VHL> I keep telling you we go out with a bang

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[22:19] <VCI-Bob> it'll be a bang all right :)

[22:20] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bang?

[22:20] <Tim-VHL> we will be in all of our nuclear glowry

[22:20] <incense11> I know one thing... we go out Spotless

[22:20] <VCI-Bob> ok - no one answered my question

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[22:20] <VCI-Bob> In that day the LORD will punish the powers in the heavens above and the kings on the earth below. (Isaiah 24:21 NIV)

[22:20] <VCI-Bob> They will be herded together like prisoners bound in a dungeon; they will be shut up in prison and be punished after many days. (Isaiah 24:22 NIV)

[22:20] <VCI-Bob> What is this talking about?

[22:20] <EZGuest5> I really think that this bible study would be a blessing

[22:20] <Bezalel-VHL> 2It made me think of Satan being cast into the Abyss...

[22:21] <VCI-Bob> First of all, the phrase "in that day" is used often in the Bible to speak of the end times

[22:21] <Sarah-VHL> 6^5 Bez!

[22:21] <EZGuest5> If anyone wants it I will email it You will not find a more profound message

[22:21] <VCI-Bob> Right, Bez

[22:21] <Tim-VHL> that Bob is the angels that followed Azazel

[22:21] <VCI-Bob> the "powers"

[22:21] <VCI-Bob> the demonic powers that rebelled against God

[22:21] <Tim-VHL> they are bound in their own private little prison in hell right now

[22:21] <VCI-Bob> and their co-conspirators on the earth, the world leaders

[22:22] <VCI-Bob> (see Psalm 2)

[22:22] <Tim-VHL> Azazel is the Hebrew name for satan

[22:22] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Why the use of the the phrase "after many days"? Bob.

[22:22] <VCI-Bob> Could that be speaking of the 1000 years?

[22:22] <Tim-VHL> they have been in there since they committed their sin with the women on earth

[22:23] <VCI-Bob> the next verse is the climax:

[22:23] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bob, you mean the 1000 years Jesus reigns?

[22:23] <VCI-Bob> The moon will be abashed, the sun ashamed; for the LORD Almighty will reign on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem, and before its elders, gloriously. (Isaiah 24:23 NIV)

[22:23] <VCI-Bob> Yes, Sarah, just a suggestion

[22:23] <VCI-Bob> we all know what THAT is talking about :)

[22:23] <Sarah-VHL> 6yay!

[22:24] <Sarah-VHL> 6Jesus outshines them all?

[22:24] <VCI-Bob> yes!!!

[22:24] <VCI-Bob> so you can see the sequence of events in this chapter

[22:24] <Tim-VHL> Yeshua reigns for 1000 years but then satan is released, right?

[22:24] <VCI-Bob> right

[22:25] <VCI-Bob> now.. chapters 25 and 26 follow logically, speaking at times in retrospect, from the perspective of the people on the earth when Jesus begins to rule

[22:25] <VCI-Bob> not always, but much of it

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[22:26] <VCI-Bob> After Jesus defeats all His foes..

[22:26] <VCI-Bob> and begins to rule...

[22:26] <VCI-Bob> this is what the people say...

[22:26] <VCI-Bob> O LORD, you are my God; I will exalt you and praise your name, for in perfect faithfulness you have done marvelous things, things planned long ago. (Isaiah 25:1 NIV)

[22:26] <Tim-VHL> why is 2Thess 2 post trib

[22:27] <VCI-Bob> they are looking back at what the Lord has just done, what we say in chapter 24

[22:27] <Sarah-VHL> 6We praise Him!

[22:27] <VCI-Bob> right, Sarah!

[22:27] <VCI-Bob> Tim, hold that thought :) actually, I had written on that subject on the VHL forums some time ago

[22:28] <VCI-Bob> The next few verses speak of

[22:29] <Tim-VHL> I think I am going to get killed by my wife tomorrow because she was supposed to call me tonight to tell me what time to pick her up at the airport. Bob, I will be looking into that. Shalom and may God remove all your pressures and fill you with His peace

[22:29] <VCI-Bob> the honor that the Lord will receive for the judgments He performed

[22:29] <VCI-Bob> oops, Tim

[22:29] <VCI-Bob> Shalom, thanks Tim

[22:29] <Sarah-VHL> 6:->

[22:29] <VCI-Bob> blessings to you :)

[22:29] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bye Tim, be blessed!

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[22:30] <Judy-VHL> 5Goodnight Tim, or should we say .........goodbye.......LOL

[22:30] <incense11> I am so tired tonight.... have to go... Shalom all

[22:30] <Sarah-VHL> 6ouch

[22:30] <VCI-Bob> and the honor He will receive for taking a stand on behalf of the weak and oppressed

[22:30] <DragonMaster151> I have a question. In Matthew 24:32-35 what do YOU all think Yeshua is saying?

[22:30] <Sarah-VHL> 6bye incense!

[22:30] <incense11> Be blessed

[22:30] <VCI-Bob> Shalom, Incense

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[22:30] <Judy-VHL> 5God bless, Incense

[22:30] <Sarah-VHL> 6Hi DragonmMaster

[22:31] <DragonMaster151> Hello

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> We will pick up in Isaiah next week, so be prepared :)

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> ok - let's take a look, DM

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> I'm going to back up a few verses to give some context

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> "Immediately after the distress of those days "'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.' (Matthew 24:29 NIV)

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> "At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:30 NIV)

[22:31] <VCI-Bob> And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other. (Matthew 24:31 NIV)

[22:32] <VCI-Bob> "Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. (Matthew 24:32 NIV)

[22:32] <VCI-Bob> Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. (Matthew 24:33 NIV)

[22:32] <VCI-Bob> I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. (Matthew 24:34 NIV)

[22:32] <VCI-Bob> Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. (Matthew 24:35 NIV)

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[22:32] <VCI-Bob> Jesus is telling us about His triumphant and glorious return

[22:32] <VCI-Bob> and telling us to be looking

[22:33] <VCI-Bob> that when we "see all these things" we will know it's soon

[22:33] <VCI-Bob> and that His words are a certainty to be fulfilled

[22:33] <VCI-Bob> because He always does what He says He would :)

[22:33] <DragonMaster151> But about the fig tree and the generatin whatdoes he mean by this in your oppinion?

[22:34] <DragonMaster151> Ick I can't type...

[22:34] <VCI-Bob> The common interpretation is that it is referring to Israel being formed as a nation, in 1948, the "fig tree"

[22:34] <Sarah-VHL> 6:-) DM

[22:34] DragonMaster151 thinks his battries are low again

[22:35] <Kathy-VHL> the Fig Tree signifies 2 things doesn't it Bob the literal Fig tree and the symbolic Israel?

[22:35] <VCI-Bob> and that some who were alive for that event will be alive for Jesus' return

[22:35] <Sarah-VHL> 6Kathy has a good point...

[22:35] <VCI-Bob> I don't know, Kathy - I did a study on this just the other day, and could not really see where else Israel was referred to as a fig tree

[22:36] <Kathy-VHL> then how do we relate it to Israel

[22:36] <VCI-Bob> unless....

[22:36] <Sarah-VHL> 6Bob, I wonder if it is an analogy of how to know when to look for the return of Jesus?

[22:36] <VCI-Bob> it's talking about the incident that happened shortly before that

[22:36] <VCI-Bob> remember, when Jesus cursed the fig tree, because it had no fruit?

[22:37] <Judy-VHL> 5Yes

[22:37] DragonMaster151 thoght the fig tree and the olive tree were both symbolic of isreal

[22:37] <Judy-VHL> 5In Matthew.

[22:37] <aquaman-VHL> It is suggested that the fig tree that withered upon his command symbolized Israel

[22:37] <VCI-Bob> so....... when the fig tree starts bearing fruit again, look out

[22:37] <Kathy-VHL> It seems to me to be giving an example of how we know what to look for like looking at a fig tree

[22:37] <aquaman-VHL> Having no fruit

[22:37] <VCI-Bob> right, Aqua

[22:37] <DragonMaster151> Matthew 21 18-22 the cursing of the fig tree...

[22:37] <VCI-Bob> so.... it may not be talking about 1948 at all...

[22:38] <aquaman-VHL> he then would be suggesting that Israel was going to rise again but still with leaves only bearing no fruit

[22:38] <VCI-Bob> but about seeing more Jews receiving Jesus as their Messiah and "bearing fruit"

[22:38] <Kathy-VHL> well she doesn't bear fruit untill she accepts Jesus riht

[22:38] <VCI-Bob> good point, aqua

[22:39] DragonMaster151 thinks back

[22:39] <VCI-Bob> you are right

[22:39] <VCI-Bob> Jesus does not mention "fruit" in v 32

[22:39] <Judy-VHL> 5Huh? Oh well, I think I might be a little lost, but please continue.....

[22:39] <VCI-Bob> only leaves

[22:39] <VCI-Bob> meaning that fruit is soon to follow

[22:39] <VCI-Bob> interesting

[22:39] <Sarah-VHL> 6Judy, I am catching up slowly....lol

[22:40] <Kathy-VHL> right

[22:40] <VCI-Bob> so... in 1948, leaves :)

[22:40] <VCI-Bob> now, just a few hints of fruit :)

[22:40] <Kathy-VHL> Buds

[22:40] <Sarah-VHL> 6yeah.!

[22:40] <VCI-Bob> bottom line - ya bettah be lookin up :)

[22:40] <aquaman-VHL> The generation seeing the signs given for the end times, as one would see the leaves of the fig tree knows that summer ie end times are near

[22:40] <Sarah-VHL> 6:-)

[22:41] <Kathy-VHL> thats how i understand it

[22:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6Me too, only you put it better!

[22:41] <DragonMaster151> The jews eraning their land back could be bearing fruit...

[22:41] <Judy-VHL> 5In other words.....we are THE generation.

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[22:41] <Sarah-VHL> 6Standing (sitting) in awe

[22:42] <Sarah-VHL> 6Good stuff there DM!

[22:42] <Kathy-VHL> or at least part of it Judy lol

[22:42] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> hello everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[22:42] <VCI-Bob> look carefully at this verse: Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. (Matthew 24:33 NIV)

[22:42] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6hello everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[22:42] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6hello everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[22:42] <Judy-VHL> 5Hi Audra

[22:42] <Kathy-VHL> Hi Audra

[22:42] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6hello everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[22:42] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Hello, Audra

[22:42] <Sarah-VHL> 6Hi

[22:42] <VCI-Bob> now, the "these things" that Jesus described earlier are things that will be happening during the "tribulation"....

[22:43] <Sarah-VHL> 63(I feel like being green like a leaf!)

[22:43] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6kathy are you my teacher mrs,grendahl??

[22:43] <VCI-Bob> so, if the believers are already gone, how would they "see all these things" he described?

[22:43] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6kathy, are you my teacher mrs.grendahl??

[22:43] <Judy-VHL> 5Audra........Bob is teaching us something.

[22:43] <VCI-Bob> Hi Audra :)

[22:43] <Kathy-VHL> No Audra I am not your teacher

[22:43] <aquaman-VHL> That generation will NOT pass away... In those times they will search for death but will not find it (Trib generation)

[22:44] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6what is it

[22:44] <VCI-Bob> I'm your teacher Bob :)

[22:44] <aquaman-VHL> until all things are fulfilled

[22:44] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6kathy what is your last name??

[22:44] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6kathy what is your last name??

[22:44] <VCI-Bob> We are discussing the soon return of Jesus in the clouds, Audra

[22:44] <Sarah-VHL> 3Hi Bob the Teacher!

[22:44] <VCI-Bob> LOL

[22:44] <Kathy-VHL> Smith Audra

[22:44] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6what is it??

[22:44] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Rabbi Bob?

[22:45] <VCI-Bob> nahhhh :)

[22:45] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6what is it??

[22:45] <Sarah-VHL> 3Bob....can I say something very important here?

[22:45] <VCI-Bob> ok, folks, I'm outta here...

[22:45] <VCI-Bob> sure, Sarah - go for it

[22:45] <Sarah-VHL> 3I have it on good authority

[22:45] <Kathy-VHL> He is teaching us about Jesus Audra

[22:45] <Judy-VHL> 5I don't blame you, Bob.

[22:45] <Sarah-VHL> 3that YOU had a birthday yesterday!

[22:45] <Kathy-VHL> Audra go get your Bible so you can read it with us

[22:45] <VCI-Bob> no, no reason, Judy, just gonna go be with my wife :)

[22:46] <Sarah-VHL> 3HAPPY Belated Birthday Bob!

[22:46] <VCI-Bob> yes, tis true, Sarah

[22:46] <VCI-Bob> thanks - actually, Tuesday

[22:46] <Kathy-VHL> Happy Birthday Bob

[22:46] <Judy-VHL> 5The best reason of all............I don't blame you for that.....and Happy Birthday!

[22:46] <Sarah-VHL> 3Passing out party favors here

[22:46] <VCI-Bob> :)

[22:46] <Sarah-VHL> 3A toast to our good teacher and friend!

[22:46] <VCI-Bob> thanks for another good evening of discussion, everyone

[22:46] <Sarah-VHL> 3(getting toast from toaster)

[22:46] DragonMaster151 breaks out a bottle of gape juice and starts passing out glasses of it

[22:46] <aquaman-VHL> I recently ignored, er, had a birthday too <s>

[22:46] <VCI-Bob> and for the birthday greetings

[22:47] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6what is the story about bob??? and mabe you could give me some bible verses from the story as you go along in the story bob????

[22:47] <VCI-Bob> thanks, DM :)

[22:47] <Kathy-VHL> Thank you Bob

[22:47] <Audra_Kaye_M_-VHL> 6what is the story about bob??? and mabe you could give me some bible verses from the story as you go along in the story bob????

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[22:47] <Kathy-VHL> It is in Mathew 25 Audra

[22:47] <Sarah-VHL> 3Have a good night, Bob

[22:47] <VCI-Bob> I'm leaving, Audra, but others will stay to discuss the Lord :)

[22:47] <DragonMaster151> Shalom fran

[22:47] <Judy-VHL> 5When was your birthday, aquaman? Mine was the 2nd of this month.

[22:47] <VCI-Bob> good night :)

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[22:47] <Bezalel-VHL> 2Night, Bob.

[22:47] <Kathy-VHL> It is about Jesus coming back to get us and take us to heaven

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